hn1271n wrote:
1馬赫=每秒前進34...(恕刪)
F-22巡航速度是1.6~1.8馬赫 T-50巡航速度是1.4馬赫 兩者都能在不開後燃器下超音速巡航
所以兩者的相對速度至少達到1.6+1.4=3馬赫(音速3倍) 以上
而空戰最後關鍵時刻一定會開啟後燃器 所以交戰雙方會以4馬赫的速度接近(每秒1.3公里)
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hn1271n wrote:
只要有動能 飛彈就能...(恕刪)
動能不等於機動能力 沒有剩餘燃料沒有機動能力就不可改變彈道
只要航向偏轉2~5度 垂直機動都不用就能甩開導彈
當導彈只剩下動能也就是(拋物線)落下是不可能改變變彈道的不然你幹嘛不拿彈道彈去打飛機
因為他不能機動只能打固定目標
(彈道導彈在燃料燒燃後沒機動能力 只是拋物線落下 也不能追蹤目標)
只剩下動能 就只能慣性飛行 而沒有機動剩餘的燃料就沒有加速度 是無法打中隨機移動的機動目標的
我想各位應該都學過國中的牛頓三大定律 這是物理常識
光有用動能只靠慣性飛行是沒有辦法改變速度和航向的
更沒有辦法追擊移動得目標
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慣性飛行 例如彈道導彈 砲彈等等 都是以拋物線落下 無法打在飛行中的運動目標 或移動車輛 船艦
而彈道導彈在落下時有動能 但是只能打非固定目標 不能打運動中的目標
這是依造牛噸第一定律(慣性定律) 靜者恆靜動者恆動 慣性飛行在受引力拋物線落下 最大動力射程就是指這個
機動飛行 例如空對空導彈 空對艦導彈 飛行中的戰鬥機 都是機動飛行
都是可以在飛行中突然改變方向和追蹤目標
但是前提是導彈 或飛機 或船艦還有勝於燃料進行機動 機動能力=加速度的能力 不是慣形飛行
牛頓第二定律F=M*a(加速度定律)
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abc003 wrote:
動能不等於機動能力 沒有剩餘燃料沒有機動能力就不可改變彈道
只要航向偏轉2~5度 垂直機動都不用就能甩開導彈
你根本就弄錯了，
飛彈的發動機是用來保持飛彈的動能的，
飛彈的轉向等等機動能力都是來自飛彈各翼面的控制舵，
由內部電池提供動力，
(除非這飛彈有向量噴嘴可以額外提供機動力)
就算飛彈耗盡燃料，
只要還有足夠的動能，
你就算要它上下左右個來個360度翻跟斗都是可以的，
只不過各種機動動作都會產生額外阻力加速消耗飛彈的動能，
在飛彈沒有發動機補充動能下，
戰機可以藉著各類機動動作引導飛彈相對加速消耗飛彈的動能。
但絕沒有一個戰機飛行員會對前方飛來的飛彈(不論還有無燃料)，
作出你所說的這種應對方式，
因為他們不會有你這種錯誤的想法。
人類中最卑鄙無恥的是，
權力擁有者和諂媚權貴者，
藏身安全場所歌詠戰爭，
用愛國心將無知者送往戰場！
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abc003 wrote:
但是前提是導彈 或飛機 或船艦還有勝於燃料進行機動 機動能力=加速度的能力 不是慣形飛行
牛頓第二定律F=M*a(加速度定律) ...(恕刪)
天吶
在天空飛的東西是F=ma???
F=Ma只適用於質點動力學
飛機與飛彈
有體積有質量
所以有線性運動與轉動
也就是X-Y-Z的運動
與
Yaw, Pitch, Roll
如圖所示
所以
加速度不會是f=ma
而應是:
而機體與彈體除了線性運動外
還有角動量
在X-Y-Z軸的動量總合 (Momentum equations,包含線動量與角動量)
如果講飛機或飛彈的操控
空間三軸運動會有21個誤差值要feed back control
心的通透 並非沒有雜念 而是明白取捨
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abc003 wrote:
那也就是透過尾翼的偏...(恕刪)
http://www.x-plane.org/home/urf/aviation/text/missiles/aam.html
這裡的資料說AIM-120 AMRAAM先進中程空空導彈 的不可逃離區是30公里
在30公里範圍內他有9G加速度的追殺能力轉向 而飛行員最高只能承受9G加速度
但是對於低機動性和靈敏度的飛機(例如轟炸機 民航機這類) 不可逃離區可以提高射程到50~60公里
而他開頭又說例如R-77 最大射程有100公里 但是他的不可逃離區是25公里
所以各國空對空導彈都是這樣的 根本不可能在最大射程開火
實際空戰距離會在AAM導彈最大射程的1/2~1/3開打 因為這是導彈的有效射程
也就是說30~50公里是實際的空戰交戰距離
如果樓上之前的論點是正確的 在109公里外F-22發射AIM120
他100%會脫靶 不論APG-77性能如何 導彈都已經失去了機動性能 無法追殺會自由改變方向和航速的飛機
Air-to-air missile non-comparison table
Especially not range, for which the correct answer always is "it depends".
[Range vs altitude/aspect]
To take one example, the Vympel R-77 has a stated range of 100 km against a head-on target at high altitude, but only 25 km in a stern chase. At low altitude it can fire at head-on targets at 20 km, from which we can guess range in a stern chase is 5 km. (See the above diagram.)
And this is presumably against targets that don't try to evade.
Range varies similarily for AIM-7C.
Target and shooter both at M 0.9
altitude head on tail chase
50.000'/16km 14.000-37.000 feet/4.5-12km 8.200-25.000 feet/3-8km
30.000'/10km 9.500-34.000 feet/3-11km 4.200-20.000 feet/1.6-6km
sea level 9.500-19.000 feet/3-6.5km 2.000- 5.700 feet/0.6-1.9km
The improvements planned for, but at the time of writing (2000) cancelled, future versions of AMRAAM include the ability to engage 9G manouevring targets at 30 km, which will let it engage non-agile targets at more than 60 km, which gives a good idea of the range difference depending on type of target.
This is what the Swedish air force says are typical ranges for some missiles
Low altitude High altitude
Rb 24J Sidewinder about 1000 m slightly more than 3000 m (AIM-9P)
Rb 71 SkyFlash a couple of km well over 10 km
Rb 74 Sidewinder, AIM-9L
Can be fired at even shorter ranges and more extreme angles than
AIM-9J, as well as handle even more agile targets.
Not quite as impressive as some of the numbers usually given, but these are ranges usable in practice, most of the time.
Also, range and speed aren't everything when it comes to missile performance. For example, the AIM-7E and -7E Sparrow missiles had a higher allowed G loading during launch than the concurrent AIM-9E Sidewinder, which may have been a factor why they were used otherwise surprisingly often.
The R-3S were limited to launch at less then 2G up to an altitude 15 km and 1.6G over that, the AIM-9B/D 2-2.5G. Presumably almost the same goes for the AIM-9E, but the AIM-9J introduced in 1972 allowed the launching aircraft to turn at up to 7G.
The AIM-9E and -9J Sidewinders both had a rocket motor impulse of 8,800 lb/s, burn time of 2.2 s, peak thrust of 4,200 lb, giving an acceleration of 28G. But there are interesting differences as well:
Seeker Seeker Servo Torque Guidance Lateral G
track cage torque feedback duration capability one plane
rate rate servo sea level/16 km
AIM-9B 10/4 G (?)
AIM-9E 12 10 750lb-in No 20 s 11/6 G
AIM-9J 16 16 1050lb-in Yes 40 s 22/13 G
deg/s deg/s/deg
Does this mean the AIM-9J was better at everything than the AIM-9E?
The above was intended to give it both a shorter minimum engagement range and larger max range at high altitude. For targets with large aspect angeles it really was much better, but the torque feedback servo caused overcontrolling for targets with small aspect angles, resulting in excessive manoeuvring = more drag and shorter range.
The AIM-9B had a rather small envelope at low altitude and fast targets: For a shot straight from behind, both aircraft flying at M0.8 at sea level the minimum range was 3000 foot, max range 4000 foot in straight and level flight. If the target was turning at 3G it was 3250 and 3750 foot, if it was turning at 5G there wasn't any envelope at all.
A usenet article: Re: US AAMs 0-for-6 - about AAM hit statistics.
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而如AIM-9X R-73等一類短程的紅外線導引空空導彈有失量推力噴嘴能改變火箭噴口方向而轉向
AIM-120P3I 可能有推力失量
Raytheon Defense Systems (Hughes)
AIM-120A AR 0.5/50 4 157 365/18/53 AMRAAM non-reprogrammable (without hardware change)
USAF AMRAAM factsheet
USN AMRAAM factsheet
AMRAAM
AIM-120B as AIM-120A, with electronics upgrade including new processor and EEPROMs, reprogrammable in the field.
AIM-120C AR 0.5/50 4 157 365/18/45 Smaller span for internal carriage, reprogrammable ECCM. The USAF
All-Up-Round (AUR) container houses an internal cable which enables up to four missiles to be reprogrammed while
in the container. USN containers are not equipped with the cable and must be opened to reprogram the missile.
Can be noted that kinematic range if launched at M1.5 is 50% greater than if launched at M0.9.
AIM-120C4 /C5 AR 0.5/50 4 157 365/18/45 Longer motor/shorter control section, new 10% smaller warhead
A "Passive adjunct seeker" was demonstrated in 1998, will home on
emitted radar signals and revert to active radar if necessary.
Look angle increased from +-25 deg to +-70 deg (or perhaps from B or C)
AIM-120C-6 Improved fuse
AIM-120C-7 Improved homing algorithm and thus greater range
AIM-120D GPS-aided INS, conformal front antenna, 50% greater range than C-7,
suitable for electronic attack environment, first flight test 2008
AIM-120 P3I P3 planned (around 2000), larger motor like ERAAM
AIM-120 P3I P4 planned (around 2000) for production in 2010, gel fuel, possibly thrust vectoring (a la Dual Range AAM)
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