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2017 GSF

dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87121096

Actually premium cars are not always much heavier than non-premium cars...

ES350: 3690lbs, 195.9Lx73.4Wx56.9H
Camry 3.5: 3595lbs, 192.1Lx72.4Wx56.9H

Integra: 3150lbs, 185.8Lx72Wx55.5H
Civic 1.5t: 3102lbs, 179.9Lx70.9Wx55.7H
(Not sure why Integra has about the same weight as Civic, although Integra is a bit larger???

Carbon fiber??? I don't think so, as both MSRPs are not high!!!)

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87126946

Again, much smaller 370Z doesn't weight much lighter... (This little Nissan could be more rigid than its big brothers from Infiniti)

370Z: 3439lbs, 167.5Lx72.6Wx51.8H
G37(coupe): 3633lbs, 183.1Lx71.8Wx54.8H
G37(sedan): 3581lbs, 187Lx69.8Wx57.2H

2023 Z:3602lbs, 172.4Lx72.6Wx51.8H
(Again, new Z gets a bit heavier than the old Z... More rigid???)

By the way, now Z weights about as same as full-size sedans like Camry or ES350!!! 嚇到吃手手

嚇到吃手手

PS: It seems car makers try to make smaller cars to be more rigid... (of course, the pre-condition is they all should be at similar price level!!! 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

)

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87126962

So, some cars weight heavier than the others...

I think car makers are not stupid especially for these mature German and Japanese car makers. If they could reduce the weight, they will definitely do it, as any additional weight could reduce performance and increase MPG which let their cars look bad on paper!!!

So, there must be SOME REASONS why these cars weight heavier than the others... 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87127127

370Z: 390ps, 1480kg, 275/35r19
GT-R: 800ps, 1700kg, 275/35r19
S2000: 410ps, 1100kg, 265/35r18
M3: 435ps, 1540kg, 295/30r18
----------------------
370Z: power/weight=0.26, tire/weight=0.186, lap=26"793
GT-R: power/weight=0.47, tire/weight=0.162, lap=26"549
S2000: power/weight=0.37, tire/weight=0.241, lap=25"536
M3: power/weight=0.28, tire/weight=0.192, lap=25"946
----------------------

In Gunsai, tires are much more important than power!!! 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

PS: For me, power is much more important, as I never did 10/10th at corners in my car... 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87127153

Be honest... For 30 year driving I NEVER did 10/10th at corners in my cars including 1992 Civic LX with only 105hp!!!

I only did 10/10th in karting or sim-racing games... 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87132737

These Porsches weight a bit lighter but I don't think Porsche adopts a lot of carbon fibers for them. (Maybe GT3 adopt some but definitely not a lot!!!)

2021 911 Carrera S: 3382lbs, 177.9Lx72.9Wx51.1H
2021 911 Carrera GT3: 3164lbs, 180Lx72.9Wx50.4H
(GT3 costs supercar like money. So we see some weight reduction on it.)

2021 Cayman GTS: 3166lbs, 173.5Lx70.9Wx50.2H
2021 Cayman GT4: 3208lbs, 175.4Lx70.9Wx50.0H

370Z: 3439lbs, 167.5Lx72.6Wx51.8H
2023 Z:3602lbs, 172.4Lx72.6Wx51.8H

PS: I think that could be why we saw a lot of strut tower crack issues on European performance cars but not on Japanese performance cars!!! 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

(You can also Google "strut tower crack" by yourself... Then, you will understand what I mean... 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

)

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87133235

This fancy Japanese supercar LFA, 65% of which is made by CARBON FIBER, but it still only weights about as heavy as 911. 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

(I don't think 911s are extensively made by carbon fiber like LFA...)

LFA : 3263lbs, 177.4Lx74.6x48H

2021 911 Carrera S: 3382lbs, 177.9Lx72.9Wx51.1H
2021 911 Carrera GT3: 3164lbs, 180Lx72.9Wx50.4H

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87133242

The below is directly from Lexus.com about weight reduction on RCFs... (Of course, those weight reduction cannot reduce weight dramatically except fully carbon fiber implementation!!!)

PS: Now, I understand why many European cars have weak A/C!!! 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

-----------------

Precise Targets for Weight Reduction
One of the first targets for the engineering team was reducing weight without compromising the coupe’s sense of refinement and solidity. A more specific objective was to take weight out of the car at its extremes, as even the most modest changes at the front and rear of the car result in significant reductions in rotational inertia. Numerous components under the hood were scrutinized for weight reduction before the engineers chose the intake manifold as one key focus given its location at the top of the engine. An updated machining process was developed that removes 700 grams of excess aluminum on the underside of the manifold without altering its airflow characteristics.

Other weight saving measures under the hood include the use of a smaller compressor for the air conditioning system and newly designed aluminum spring support brackets that save an additional 700 grams of weight compared to the previous steel part. In order the construct the two-piece bracket, a TOX® connection is used to join the two aluminum sections, a process that produces a tight joint without applying heat. TOX fittings have previously been used to join aluminum body parts, but this is the first time Lexus has used the joining technology on a suspension component.

At the rear, a redesigned bumper reinforcement was developed that combines carbon fiber and aluminum to produce an equally strong, yet lighter (-500g) support piece. By bonding the carbon fiber to the extruded aluminum structure, the overall yield stress is increased while at the same time allowing the use of thinner aluminum. The carbon fiber section is produced in-house on the same production line that provided CFRP for the LFA supercar. Additional weight at the rear was taken out through the use of hollow half shafts in place of the previous solid shafts which shaves another 4 pounds with no reduction in shaft strength.

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87133326

This slightly bigger Civic Type R weights lighter than carbon fiber built LFA... (Of course, this type R is definitely NOT as rigid as LFA!!! 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

)

2023 Civic Type R : 3188lbs, 180.9Lx74.4Wx55.4H
LFA : 3263lbs, 177.4Lx74.6Wx48H

However, LC500 is more rigid than LFA!!! (based on Lexus statements)

So numbers cannot tell everything, of course...

PS: I think body rigidity is very like my Ohlins suspension... They both CANNOT make car much faster but do give drivers much more CONFIDENCE!!!

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dlin4229

993分

樓主

個人積分：993分

文章編號：87134430

Better body rigidity enhances PRECISE handling... (especially for some very stiff aftermarket suspensions like Ohlins!!! 笑到噴淚

笑到噴淚

)

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